<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
	xmlns:series="http://unfoldingneurons.com/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Waste Time! Talk! You&#8217;re at Work!</title>
	<atom:link href="http://sevenred.net/2008/06/27/waste-time-talk-youre-at-work/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://sevenred.net/2008/06/27/waste-time-talk-youre-at-work/#utm_source=feed&#038;utm_medium=feed&#038;utm_campaign=feed</link>
	<description></description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 28 Jan 2012 04:06:29 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1</generator>
	<item>
		<title>By: topspun</title>
		<link>http://sevenred.net/2008/06/27/waste-time-talk-youre-at-work/comment-page-1/#comment-164</link>
		<dc:creator>topspun</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Jun 2008 21:53:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sevenred.net/?p=187#comment-164</guid>
		<description>I would just qualify the &quot;blue collar&quot; v. &quot;white collar&quot; distinction a little bit here by saying that the form of production that asks one to &quot;talk&quot; and network is not distinct from manufacture, and actually can be said to originate (in its specifically *post-Fordist* form) in the Toyota Manufacturing System (see especially Fujimoto, &lt;em&gt;The Evolution of a Manufacturing System at Toyota&lt;/em&gt;, Oxford UP, 1999) Second, I don&#039;t think Negri or Hardt make any claim that such work arrangements are universal or even &lt;em&gt;quantitatively primary&lt;/em&gt;. Indeed, in &lt;em&gt;Multitude&lt;/em&gt;, if I remember correctly, they specifically note that what they are referring to is a primary logic of production, not a quantitatively primary form. The strong argument there is that neither was Marx referring to a quantitatively primary form when he analyzed capitalist factory production (the vast majority of the world&#039;s labor at that point was still agricultural, for instance). Rather, Marx analyzed an emerging form of production the *logic* of which had become primary. This is why the supposedly &quot;empirical&quot; critiques of Hardt and Negri always ring a bit hollow (Brennan, Arrighi); it&#039;s like somebody saying to Marx &quot;Hey, buddy, they still have slave labor in most of the colonized world! Why are you talking about this wage labor stuff!?!&quot; Well, yeah, they did. But that didn&#039;t particularly help explain or identify the form of production that Marx was analyzing. More on this maybe...

That said, it&#039;s clear that the more ecstatic claims about worker empowerment through &quot;Talk! Network!&quot; management ring particularly hollow. For a great critique of post-Fordism boosters, see Vallas, &quot;Rethinking Post-Fordism:The Meaning of Workplace Flexibility.&quot; &lt;em&gt;Sociological Theory&lt;/em&gt; 17.1 (1999), p. 68-101. But I don&#039;t think either Hardt and Negri or Virno are boosters. Rather, where Vallas critiques the organizational theory claims by demonstrating that the effects don&#039;t really happen, Virno takes it in the other direction, showing how terrifying they are even if they do happen. H&amp;N follow a similar line, but try to demonstrate real potential for transformation beyond the empirical &quot;empowerment&quot; discourse. That&#039;s why the charges equating H&amp;N with such boosterism seem particularly obnoxious to me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would just qualify the &#8220;blue collar&#8221; v. &#8220;white collar&#8221; distinction a little bit here by saying that the form of production that asks one to &#8220;talk&#8221; and network is not distinct from manufacture, and actually can be said to originate (in its specifically *post-Fordist* form) in the Toyota Manufacturing System (see especially Fujimoto, <em>The Evolution of a Manufacturing System at Toyota</em>, Oxford UP, 1999) Second, I don&#8217;t think Negri or Hardt make any claim that such work arrangements are universal or even <em>quantitatively primary</em>. Indeed, in <em>Multitude</em>, if I remember correctly, they specifically note that what they are referring to is a primary logic of production, not a quantitatively primary form. The strong argument there is that neither was Marx referring to a quantitatively primary form when he analyzed capitalist factory production (the vast majority of the world&#8217;s labor at that point was still agricultural, for instance). Rather, Marx analyzed an emerging form of production the *logic* of which had become primary. This is why the supposedly &#8220;empirical&#8221; critiques of Hardt and Negri always ring a bit hollow (Brennan, Arrighi); it&#8217;s like somebody saying to Marx &#8220;Hey, buddy, they still have slave labor in most of the colonized world! Why are you talking about this wage labor stuff!?!&#8221; Well, yeah, they did. But that didn&#8217;t particularly help explain or identify the form of production that Marx was analyzing. More on this maybe&#8230;</p>
<p>That said, it&#8217;s clear that the more ecstatic claims about worker empowerment through &#8220;Talk! Network!&#8221; management ring particularly hollow. For a great critique of post-Fordism boosters, see Vallas, &#8220;Rethinking Post-Fordism:The Meaning of Workplace Flexibility.&#8221; <em>Sociological Theory</em> 17.1 (1999), p. 68-101. But I don&#8217;t think either Hardt and Negri or Virno are boosters. Rather, where Vallas critiques the organizational theory claims by demonstrating that the effects don&#8217;t really happen, Virno takes it in the other direction, showing how terrifying they are even if they do happen. H&#038;N follow a similar line, but try to demonstrate real potential for transformation beyond the empirical &#8220;empowerment&#8221; discourse. That&#8217;s why the charges equating H&#038;N with such boosterism seem particularly obnoxious to me.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Booga Face</title>
		<link>http://sevenred.net/2008/06/27/waste-time-talk-youre-at-work/comment-page-1/#comment-163</link>
		<dc:creator>Booga Face</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 30 Jun 2008 19:51:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sevenred.net/?p=187#comment-163</guid>
		<description>Wonderful summary of Virno et al...  as readable and articulate as always... now I don&#039;t have to read all that stuff myself... heh heh heh... and getting you to so ably explain all of that WAS, of course, the real purpose of my own blog post.

I just want to follow up on your final point about the immeasurability of value and the new mantra &quot;network! talk! you&#039;re at work!&quot; that has replaced the old mantra &quot;quiet! you&#039;re at work.&quot; (Though, just a parenthetical remark -- one could say that what you&#039;ve schematized as &quot;new&quot; and &quot;old&quot; could also be schematized as &quot;white collar&quot; and &quot;blue collar&quot; -- because in the video clips I&#039;ve seen of sweatshops today, talking is still prohibited, and organizing could get you killed. And this reminds me of the other critique of Negri, that he has so little to say about the reality of labor and struggle in the third world, including the bits of the third world inside the first.) In what you&#039;ve described, one of the key points is immeasurable time, because it&#039;s now also hard to tell when one is work and when is not work, and as Zizek has pointed out a million times, today&#039;s (American) society perversely demands that we enjoy... this is kind of what I hoped to indicate by emphasizing the football game scene in Pursuit of Happyness -- the scene of play where the single father&#039;s most productive work actually happens. Or, if one wanted to continue to rip on Habermas, this is the scene of the private sphere and autonomous, pastoral family time which is perhaps the most public moment in the movie. What seems important here in this social economy is the necessitiy of privation (or deprivation) in order to be a good networker -- the logic of the college frat -- which is why the single parent is the perfect image of the new &quot;network-from-home&quot; economic order. For instance, the TV show Weeds and the marajuana dealing single mom who is innovative, entrepreneurial, and whose networking talent (i.e., her sexiness) reveals how the outside (illegal drugs and blackness) is at the center of white, bourgeois society.

Meanwhile, those pictures of babygirl are incredibly cute.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wonderful summary of Virno et al&#8230;  as readable and articulate as always&#8230; now I don&#8217;t have to read all that stuff myself&#8230; heh heh heh&#8230; and getting you to so ably explain all of that WAS, of course, the real purpose of my own blog post.</p>
<p>I just want to follow up on your final point about the immeasurability of value and the new mantra &#8220;network! talk! you&#8217;re at work!&#8221; that has replaced the old mantra &#8220;quiet! you&#8217;re at work.&#8221; (Though, just a parenthetical remark &#8212; one could say that what you&#8217;ve schematized as &#8220;new&#8221; and &#8220;old&#8221; could also be schematized as &#8220;white collar&#8221; and &#8220;blue collar&#8221; &#8212; because in the video clips I&#8217;ve seen of sweatshops today, talking is still prohibited, and organizing could get you killed. And this reminds me of the other critique of Negri, that he has so little to say about the reality of labor and struggle in the third world, including the bits of the third world inside the first.) In what you&#8217;ve described, one of the key points is immeasurable time, because it&#8217;s now also hard to tell when one is work and when is not work, and as Zizek has pointed out a million times, today&#8217;s (American) society perversely demands that we enjoy&#8230; this is kind of what I hoped to indicate by emphasizing the football game scene in Pursuit of Happyness &#8212; the scene of play where the single father&#8217;s most productive work actually happens. Or, if one wanted to continue to rip on Habermas, this is the scene of the private sphere and autonomous, pastoral family time which is perhaps the most public moment in the movie. What seems important here in this social economy is the necessitiy of privation (or deprivation) in order to be a good networker &#8212; the logic of the college frat &#8212; which is why the single parent is the perfect image of the new &#8220;network-from-home&#8221; economic order. For instance, the TV show Weeds and the marajuana dealing single mom who is innovative, entrepreneurial, and whose networking talent (i.e., her sexiness) reveals how the outside (illegal drugs and blackness) is at the center of white, bourgeois society.</p>
<p>Meanwhile, those pictures of babygirl are incredibly cute.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>

